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Author Topic: eXch - instant exchange BTC / LN / XMR / LTC / ETH / ERC20  (Read 40056 times)
NotATether
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April 19, 2025, 11:01:27 AM
Merited by Pmalek (2), JayJuanGee (1)
 #1521

I'm someone with a major in Finances but lately I discovered that I love coding and web development. I'm learning JS and I was thought about learning NodeJS too. Can you tell me what's wrong with projects that are written in NodeJS?

Node is notorious for installing nested packages as dependencies of other packages which are themselves dependencies of your packages.

This has enabled people to hack the repository of one of those hacked packages and then install malware on thousands of computers even though it's not used directly by many packages, but it certainly is pulled indirectly to a lot of them.

Maybe it's better if you stay in this business? Implement KYC, that's okay, just be fair with KYC. Some exchanges ask for KYC documents to find an excuse and not send money to customers. I think we all believe that you won't do that and you'll be very fair with KYC requirements. So, please, stay in the business and implement KYC, you'll still be far better than 99% of exchanges.

That is a terrible idea.

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April 19, 2025, 11:17:13 AM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)
 #1522

I'm someone with a major in Finances but lately I discovered that I love coding and web development. I'm learning JS and I was thought about learning NodeJS too. Can you tell me what's wrong with projects that are written in NodeJS?

Node is notorious for installing nested packages as dependencies of other packages which are themselves dependencies of your packages.

This has enabled people to hack the repository of one of those hacked packages and then install malware on thousands of computers even though it's not used directly by many packages, but it certainly is pulled indirectly to a lot of them.


I will also add that NodeJs, just like js, has several cryptography failures, which is very complicated for a cryptocurrency wallet project.

There is a big list of vulnerabilities here and how to mitigate them
https://www.cobalt.io/blog/node-js-vulnerabilities

I think Nodejs is a good language and tool that gets the job done. But not fit for the standards required by eXch.

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April 19, 2025, 11:42:52 AM
Merited by bitmover (1), mmgen-py (1)
 #1523

I will also add that NodeJs, just like js, has several cryptography failures, which is very complicated for a cryptocurrency wallet project.

Which is why building a website out of nodejs is such a bad idea. With the other reason being that you can't actually access the crypto functions from client-side JS, so you have to rely on polyfills which are not as secure, and may have their own vulnerabilities.

It is certainly not a programming language you want to use if there is an Advanced Persistent Threat or state actor among your list of potential adversaries (which applies to any crypto project that wants serious adoption).

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April 19, 2025, 12:09:00 PM
 #1524

Back on topic, if eXch ever comes back.

Although USD stablecoins are amazing for quick trades, I was thinking about holding some gold long term, but I would like to have some privacy.

I discovered XAUT (tether gold) and PAXG(Pax Gold).

I understand the risk of frozen assets , and it is a risk to eXch. Does a solution similar to DAI exist? Or would it be best just to swap ETH/XAUT in a DEX such as uniswap?

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April 19, 2025, 12:39:33 PM
Merited by LFC_Bitcoin (3), JayJuanGee (1)
 #1525

Back on topic, if eXch ever comes back.

Although USD stablecoins are amazing for quick trades, I was thinking about holding some gold long term, but I would like to have some privacy.

I discovered XAUT (tether gold) and PAXG(Pax Gold).

I understand the risk of frozen assets , and it is a risk to eXch. Does a solution similar to DAI exist? Or would it be best just to swap ETH/XAUT in a DEX such as uniswap?

I guess DEXes are the way to go.
I also understand the rationale of your trade, even if I would doubt about the long term prospect of XAU/BTC, that is at the maximum of recent history.
I would be more bullish Bitcoin, actually.
Best long term trade around.

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April 19, 2025, 12:50:03 PM
 #1526


I would be more bullish Bitcoin, actually.
Best long term trade around.

Ia gree with you. I am also more bullish in bitcoin.

However,  in case we are both wrong, I am thinking about diversifying a little of my crypto stash in gold. Maybe it is a bad moment, but I am way too ovetinvested in bitcoin

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April 19, 2025, 12:55:06 PM
Merited by Pmalek (2)
 #1527

I am thinking about diversifying a little of my crypto stash in gold. Maybe it is a bad moment, but I am way too ovetinvested in bitcoin
At the risk of being off-topic: if you want to invest in gold: buy gold! Don't buy a centrally controlled token that puts you at the mercy of a company.

¡uʍop ǝpᴉsdn pɐǝɥ ɹnoʎ ɥʇᴉʍ ʎuunɟ ʞool no⅄
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April 19, 2025, 01:07:22 PM
 #1528

I am thinking about diversifying a little of my crypto stash in gold. Maybe it is a bad moment, but I am way too ovetinvested in bitcoin
At the risk of being off-topic: if you want to invest in gold: buy gold! Don't buy a centrally controlled token that puts you at the mercy of a company.

Yeah, but i want some privacy (so etf are not the best option) I also doesn't want some gold bars in my house (which i would probably buy them way overpriced compared to etf or tokens.  They would also have bad liquidity and would be difficult to sell for a fair price)

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April 19, 2025, 02:55:52 PM
Merited by JayJuanGee (1)
 #1529


I would be more bullish Bitcoin, actually.
Best long term trade around.

Ia gree with you. I am also more bullish in bitcoin.

However,  in case we are both wrong, I am thinking about diversifying a little of my crypto stash in gold. Maybe it is a bad moment, but I am way too ovetinvested in bitcoin

LOL.
I cannot understand how possible is it to be over invested in bitcoin!
I am underinvested! I am banging my hard on the wall constantly: “ I don’t have enough bitcoin”.
/j

I feel you, but detach from the trading timeframe and try to look at the long run.
There is no second best.


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April 19, 2025, 03:57:10 PM
 #1530

What pressure do you mean?
Pressure after Bybit hack and claims that large amount of stolen money went through eXch,


Do you think that this is a backfire from those fake projects that exch launched campaign against?
No. They explained what's the reason for closing it down (government agencies looking into them and probably trying to shut them down).


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April 19, 2025, 04:04:43 PM
Merited by fillippone (3), JayJuanGee (1)
 #1531

I want to thank the exch team for the excellent service. I've been used them for 3 or 4 years now and never had an issue, if something went stuck the issue was resolved within hours. And I believe there should be more privacy-protecting services, not less every year Sad But of course I can understand the move.

Maybe in the medium term the situation for non-KYC services could improve again if more countries follow the US decision to not enact policies against crypto privacy services that strictly anymore [1]. We have to wait if they're serious with this approach though ...

[1] https://www.justice.gov/dag/media/1395781/dl

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April 19, 2025, 07:18:58 PM
Merited by fillippone (5), bitmover (2)
 #1532

I would be more bullish Bitcoin, actually.
Best long term trade around.
Ia gree with you. I am also more bullish in bitcoin.

However,  in case we are both wrong, I am thinking about diversifying a little of my crypto stash in gold. Maybe it is a bad moment, but I am way too ovetinvested in bitcoin
LOL.
I cannot understand how possible is it to be over invested in bitcoin!
I am underinvested! I am banging my hard on the wall constantly: “ I don’t have enough bitcoin”.
/j
I feel you, but detach from the trading timeframe and try to look at the long run.
There is no second best.

First, just to stay somewhat on topic, I am also saddened by eXch's decision to shut down their services, even though surely individuals likely feel persecution pressures when such persecutions seem to be taking place, and there are likely difficulties maintaining decently good OpSec, even when following the better of available practices...

So then from a user's perspective, it may well take several years for users to start to feel more and more comfortable with somewhat decentralized exchanges and/or the tools that they provide. and also perhaps other reputable members of this forum vouching for the services and/or perhaps a track record of nobody getting rug pulled and/or locked out under questionable circumstances regarding the behavior of the exchange.

As trust is gained, then liquidity likely increases, and thus making the service available to (and practical for) larger and larger players, some of whom are not dealing with their own money.. so yeah perhaps with increased liquidity and more solid of a reputation, then the authorities become more concerned about the extent to which bad actors are starting to use the services that had previously been more obscure based on its having had been smaller, and I am not even saying that the authorities are necessarily engaging in good faith, since it also seems to me that there are so many somewhat subtle ways that our abilities to directly transact are being attacked, and perhaps we might not even need some of the decentralized exchange systems if there were more ways that we might be able to assume that our coins were able to have some built in privacy.. not that I am claiming to know the solution and/or the right balance since bitcoin was purposefully designed with a certain amount of transparency that has ended up having several drawbacks with some of the data analysis tools.

Second, regarding the question of being overinvested, it seems to me that sometimes such term of overinvested is merely used as an excuse to trade, since if a person is still feeling that he does not have enough bitcoin, then it would be diffiuclt to feel overexposed, even though at the same time, once we might put the equivalent of 1 year's of our income/expenses into bitcoin, and then perhaps we might also have 3-6 months in cash or cash equivalents, as our bitcoin continues to grow through investment and/or appreciation, we also might feel that we want to keep more than 3-6 months in cash or cash equivalents, so then we get the sense that we want our non-bitcoin assets to be working for us rather than depreciating in value at the rate that various kinds of cash (or fiat) tends to depreciate... so in that sense, if we might start out building our investment in bitcoin and cash and we don't have any other investment categories, then I can see where some of us might want to have a bit of diversification outside of merely bitcoin and cash (or cash equivalents).

I also might have some of my own contradictions (or at least internal tensions in my own ideas of balancing) since I personally consider that a person cannot really be over invested in (or over allocated to) bitcoin until his bitcoin are worth at least 10x his income/expenses in accordance with the 200-WMA... so in that sense, a person who wants to have a $80k per year income, right now he would need to have at least 17.42 BTC in his holdings.. so then if he has more than 17.42 BTC, then he might start to feel a little bit overallocated.. but perhaps he needs to get around 10% higher than his threshold target bTC allocation level to actually start to feel overallocated.. so in the case of the current 17.42 threshold allocation, then maybe something like 19.162 BTC would be overallocated in bitcoin at this time (which is 17.42 BTC + 1.742 BTC).

Of course, I am currently using $80k per year as a target threshold level that seems practical in western location, even though surely there are guys who might want to have higher standards of living and there are guys who can tolerate and remain quite content with lower standards of living, and surely there are likely various non-western locations in which way less than $80k per year would be more than acceptable.. even something between $20k and $40k yearly might be more than sufficiently well for quite a few folks to feel that they are able to live like a king in comparison to their so far accustomed living standards.  

Another thing that I assume with bitcoin is that if you are largely able to work out your formulas and the use of the 200-WMA as your valuation formula, then you should clearly be able to give yourself an adequate cost of living increase each year, which may be 5% to 10% each year, so a 5% per year increase would be $80k in year 1, $84k in year two, $88.2k in year 3, $92.61k in year 4, etc etc.

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April 19, 2025, 07:36:32 PM
 #1533

First, just to stay somewhat on topic, I am also saddened by eXch's decision to shut down their services, even though surely individuals likely feel persecution pressures when such persecutions seem to be taking place, and there are likely difficulties maintaining decently good OpSec, even when following the better of available practices...

So then from a user's perspective, it may well take several years for users to start to feel more and more comfortable with somewhat decentralized exchanges and/or the tools that they provide. and also perhaps other reputable members of this forum vouching for the services and/or perhaps a track record of nobody getting rug pulled and/or locked out under questionable circumstances regarding the behavior of the exchange.

What as was not clear about this announcement made by eXch is that they will 'eXch will officially shutdown its operations ' but also that eXch will "Starting from the date of the merger with a new management team this month" . So, looks like the operation won't shutdown, eXch will still somehow operate under different guidance.

Let's hope for the best.


I also might have some of my own contradictions (or at least internal tensions in my own ideas of balancing) since I personally consider that a person cannot really be over invested in (or over allocated to) bitcoin until his bitcoin are worth at least 10x his income/expenses in accordance with the 200-WMA... so in that sense, a person who wants to have a $80k per year income, right now he would need to have at least 17.42 BTC in his holdings.. so then if he has more than 17.42 BTC, then he might start to feel a little bit overallocated.. but perhaps he needs to get around 10% higher than his threshold target bTC allocation level to actually start to feel overallocated.. so in the case of the current 17.42 threshold allocation, then maybe something like 19.162 BTC would be overallocated in bitcoin at this time (which is 17.42 BTC + 1.742 BTC).

Overallocated would be certainly a better word for what I meant. You are talking about having at least 1.5mi dollars 100% in BTC, which is certainly a lot if that is all money available. I don't think 100% btc allocation is optimal for any portfolio.

There also good other opportunities out there, from metals to equities (like nvdia, etf, etc) which also have a very good performance and even lower risk in some situations.

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April 19, 2025, 07:43:17 PM
 #1534

Calling it the end of an era would be accurate. Wishing the eXch team all the best for their future endeavours.

Well isnt this a crying shame.  I gotta say, Im real disappointed to see this announcement and  you have offered an incredibly helpful service for our community.  So thanks a ton for all your hard work over the years - its much appreciated even though things didnt turn out how we hoped.

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April 19, 2025, 07:43:45 PM
 #1535

Does anyone know? Can I still use it before May 1st? Will there be any problems? Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley
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April 19, 2025, 08:23:52 PM
Last edit: April 19, 2025, 08:34:09 PM by Stalker22
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 #1536

Does anyone know? Can I still use it before May 1st? Will there be any problems? Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley

Yes, you can still use them. eXch has announced that they will cease their operations on May 1st, so there shouldnt be any issues until then.


Unrelated note: Wow, eleven years since eXch came to the bitcointalk forum and started this thread. Eleven years. Thats insane longevity in this space. You gotta respect building a reputation like that. It really sucks when you see businesses with that kind of history bite the dust.

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April 19, 2025, 08:32:34 PM
 #1537

Does anyone know? Can I still use it before May 1st? Will there be any problems? Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley Smiley

You can't.

You can see the warning in their website. So  you can't create new orders there until the new management shows up
Quote
eXch to stop accepting new orders starting May 1st (announcement)
https://eXch.net

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April 19, 2025, 08:57:59 PM
 #1538

First, just to stay somewhat on topic, I am also saddened by eXch's decision to shut down their services, even though surely individuals likely feel persecution pressures when such persecutions seem to be taking place, and there are likely difficulties maintaining decently good OpSec, even when following the better of available practices...

So then from a user's perspective, it may well take several years for users to start to feel more and more comfortable with somewhat decentralized exchanges and/or the tools that they provide. and also perhaps other reputable members of this forum vouching for the services and/or perhaps a track record of nobody getting rug pulled and/or locked out under questionable circumstances regarding the behavior of the exchange.

What as was not clear about this announcement made by eXch is that they will 'eXch will officially shutdown its operations ' but also that eXch will "Starting from the date of the merger with a new management team this month" . So, looks like the operation won't shutdown, eXch will still somehow operate under different guidance.

Let's hope for the best.

Even though I did not read the announcement in such way, sure, it could be the case that some variation of the same (or similar) service might continue to exist, and surely there may well be some advantage for them to potentially figure out ways to break into smaller services - and surely they have some value in the name brand that they have built, so even if they tried to disconnect from their past name, there would likely be elements of trust foe anyone to move to some other service and to not be sure if the newer operation retains similar levels of integrity.  I also would imagine that there might be some aspects of their software that could be open source, yet there might also be some aspects that are not open source, yet of course, frequently when guys are concerned about being rug pulled, they might not be as concerned about the software that is being run, but instead who is behind the software, so surely creating more open source aspects does make it more difficult to figure  out who is running the service, and the value likely comes from having a certain level of consistency in terms of our considering that whatever service that we might be using, would be run with not-stealing-our-coins integrity.

I also might have some of my own contradictions (or at least internal tensions in my own ideas of balancing) since I personally consider that a person cannot really be over invested in (or over allocated to) bitcoin until his bitcoin are worth at least 10x his income/expenses in accordance with the 200-WMA... so in that sense, a person who wants to have a $80k per year income, right now he would need to have at least 17.42 BTC in his holdings.. so then if he has more than 17.42 BTC, then he might start to feel a little bit overallocated.. but perhaps he needs to get around 10% higher than his threshold target bTC allocation level to actually start to feel overallocated.. so in the case of the current 17.42 threshold allocation, then maybe something like 19.162 BTC would be overallocated in bitcoin at this time (which is 17.42 BTC + 1.742 BTC).
Overallocated would be certainly a better word for what I meant. You are talking about having at least 1.5mi dollars 100% in BTC, which is certainly a lot if that is all money available. I don't think 100% btc allocation is optimal for any portfolio.

There also good other opportunities out there, from metals to equities (like nvdia, etf, etc) which also have a very good performance and even lower risk in some situations.

Surely, even though we buy and sell bitcoin at spot prices, I personally try to not let BTC spot value prices influence the extent to which I might feel over or under allocated in my bitcoin investment, since spot prices tend to be so fickle, and surely at any point in time, the BTC prices may well end up going back to bottom prices (such as at or around 200-WMA prices).  Surely, any amount of bitcoin that might be sold at 25% or more above the 200-WMA is receiving a certain amount of surplus value so we might feel good to be able to shave off more BTC when the amount of surplus value that we get is quite a bit higher, and surely historically, we have seen surplus values (meaning BTC spot prices) that have been 10x to 20x higher than the 200-WMA.. and so right now in this particular cycle, even dating back to our uppity price moves starting in late 2022 or early 2023, so far we have ONLY gotten BTC spot prices that are around 145% higher than the 200-WMA, and surely there can be some feelings to shave off a bit of BTC for those feeling over-allocated and perhaps allocate some of that value into other investments, yet surely I would not discount bitcoin's ability to at least get into the 4x to 8x surplus values over the 200-WMA.. yet at the same time, we cannot count on those kinds of price moves taking place... yet sometimes if we are already in a position that we are feeling overallocated in bitcoin, then we sometimes might be trying to time a bit of these kinds of Upwards BTC price moves.

Of course, when I specifically am establishing what I consider to be bare minimum quantity of BTC for the valuation, I am using the 200-WMA, so then based on how many BTC that you have accumulated, from my point of view you would be able to sustainably (and perpetually) be able to withdraw 10% of the dollar value of that so long as the BTC spot price remains at least 25% higher than the 200-WMA.  Of course, guys can have their own formulas, and sometimes if there is a bit of uncertainty, it would not hurt to have at least 10% more bitcoin than the amount that you consider to be the threshold level of bitcoin needed for your withdrawal formula to work.

By the way, even though I understand that eXch and similar services (or maybe not so similar services) might be in a way better position to facilitate the exchange of digital forms (derivatives) of various kinds of asset classes, it still can be difficult to get excited about holding digital representations and to have confidence that those assets are not being overly manipulated in one way or another, and even with gold, i doubt that physically owning it completely resolves the extent to which it is, has been, and likely will continue to be manipulated, yet if a lot of the gold market comes crashing down due to various kinds of manipulation, then in those cases, it would seem that the physical would be more valuable, even though bitcoin teaches us (and you also admit the burden) that gold's physicality contributes to various ways that it is likely less valuable than bitcoin, whether it is the verifiability, the divisibility, or the various burdens of either storing it and/or transporting it, which becomes even more cumbersome if we might start to talk about $10s of thousands of value... and sure, perhaps nothing wrong with getting some price exposure while keeping overwhelming majorities of the value in bitcoin rather than various inferior investments.

I know that there can be difficulties balancing, yet I had never suggested keeping 100% value in bitcoin, even though very beginner investors might ONLY have bitcoin and cash for quite a few years until it might become justifiable to start to diversify.  I see little to no value in diversifying right from the start of investing into bitcoin, and especially we should know that some guys might ONLY be able to build up their investments by $10 to $100 per week and the lower on that price range, then the less sense it makes to be diluting our investments, but instead we likely should be concentrating on getting our bitcoin to at least some kind of a meaningful size before we might even consider diversification to be warranted.. whether that is the investment of 1 years worth of income into bitcoin or some other threshold amount that a guy might consider triggers his concerns that some further diversification beyond bitcoin and cash (or cash equivalents) has become warranted.

Also if we are investing into bitcoin from out discretionary funds, and maybe we are able to put 10% of our income aside for sustainable periods, even with that rate of investment, it could take such person 10 years to merely invest one year's worth of income into bitcoin..so it can take beginner investors a whole hell of a lot of time, just to get to a point where diversification beyond bitcoin and cash starts to seem justifiable.. and sure historically, with bitcoin have been spoiled by its appreciations, so even a person investing as low as 10% per year going back 10 years, with bitcoin, he would have had ended up having way more than 1 year's income.  In bitcoin, he likely would have had been able to reach something close to fuck you status in that period of time, meaning  his holdings (even valuating them with the 200-WMA valuation) would likely have had reached more than 10x the size of his income/expenses.

I will just give an example to make my point.  A guy who might have had a $52k income would invest $100 per week to invest $5,200 per year and $52k after 10 years (a whole year of his income), and so in bitcoin, he would have had accumulated right around 29.5 BTC. .so in that sense he would have had been way beyond his own salary and ability to live off of the BTC at his existing salary rate. 

Of course, past performance does not guarantee future results, yet each of us still might figure ways to focus on our bitcoin accumulation in order to get to the amounts that we need, and surely even right now, I would suggest that a guys who wants to substitute a $52k salary per year from his bitcoin investment, then I would suggest that right now he would need at least 11.325 bitcoin in order to start to withdraw at that rate...so any guy with a $52k salary accumulating BTC at $100 per week (10% of his salary) by now would have had achieved close to 3x his fuck you status or 3x his ability to completely replace the income that he had used to build up his bitcoin holdings at pace of having had invested 10% of his income into bitcoin.

I know that some guys have been in bitcoin for a cycle or even more and they fucked up in their BTC accumulation, so they may well have had started to accumulate bitcoin at 5% to 25% or some other rate, and maybe they started out more whimpily, but they became more aggressive later, and so it seems to me that if they continued to accumulate and they had quite a bit of passage of time (such as 1 or more cycles), then they likely are in a good place right now..and that will likely continue to be the case, even for guys who have not yet had accumulated BTC for a whole cycle and likely will continue to be the case even for guys just coming to bitcoin in very recent times.

Surely, I recognize my post is going astray, to the extent that even exchanging BTC in the process of accumulating might become an issue once a guy starts to have had built a decently good size bitcoin stash.

1) Self-Custody is a right.  Resist being labelled as: "non-custodial" or "un-hosted."  2) ESG, KYC & AML are attack-vectors on Bitcoin to be avoided or minimized.  3) How much alt (shit)coin diversification is necessary? if you are into Bitcoin, then 0%......if you cannot control your gambling, then perhaps limit your alt(shit)coin exposure to less than 10% of your bitcoin size...Put BTC here: bc1q49wt0ddnj07wzzp6z7affw9ven7fztyhevqu9k
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April 19, 2025, 09:00:52 PM
 #1539

man, this really sucks Cry
i visited the site to do an exchange and got hit in the face with the news.

eXch was my go to exchange for the past few years, ever since i stoped using CEX, i rarely used anything else to get my coins exchanged.
really sad things have come to this as i have nothing but high respect for everything they did/do for protecting users privacy.

i know those who contributed to this do scan this thread, so all i'm gonna say to you is FUCK YOU. 
instead of going after real bad actors, you target one of the good guys. so yeah, FUCK YOU.

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April 19, 2025, 11:21:54 PM
 #1540

I've just heard exch's departure. What a journey, and yes, as JG said, this is an end of an era.  Undecided
Everyone is sad about this announcement, and we've got less than 2 weeks to go before their cessation of operations. We understand that whenever something big happens to sort of billions swindled by hackers, their go-to are these privacy services and since the authorities can't track those cons anymore, they go after the service that's free-for-all.

Back on topic, if eXch ever comes back.
Maybe with another name and branding but I think that the authorities will still follow their tracks and will monitor the newly launched instant exchanges in the near future. It's hard to find another good one after exch.

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